Episode 22: Unreasonable Hospitality

What if your rhythms of life could bring a sense of delight AND security in your life, while also making you more hospitable to the people around you? Hannah and Kris invite us to consider what we can learn from Will Guidara, his pursuit to have the number one restaurant in the world, and his book ‘Unreasonable Hospitality’.


This transcript was generated automatically and may not be 100 percent accurate.

Episode transcript:

00:00:00 Hannah 

Welcome to The Rhythms podcast. My name is Hannah. 

00:00:03 Kris 

And my name's Kris. This is a podcast about exploring the rhythms, patterns and habits that bring joy and add richness to our everyday lives. 

00:00:12 Hannah 

From daily habits to embracing the changing seasons, it's not about mindless routines, but patterns with purpose. It's about making something special out of something. 

00:00:24 Kris 

If you're someone who wants to move beyond just being more efficient or productive and instead find ways to infuse your days with small, familiar moments that matter, then you've found two new friends with the same goal. 

00:00:37 Hannah 

Every episode listen in as we share a reflection on the role of rhythms in our lives. Join our conversation as we unpack this idea further and then spend a moment with us considering how that rhythm could shape or add richness to our lives today. 

00:01:00 Hannah 

I wonder what comes to mind for you when I say the word hospitality. Perhaps it describes. 

00:01:08 Hannah 

Sector in which you're currently employed. Or maybe you recall hosting guests for lunch or dinner or game nights in your family home. Perhaps it's more of a feeling that you're filled with. 

00:01:21 Hannah 

Of warmth welcome. 

00:01:24 Hannah 

A feeling you've experienced and on the receiving end of a friend, or even a stranger's hospitality. I've been thinking a lot about hospitality of late. When and how I've received it and extended it, remembering back to experiences that have. 

00:01:41 Hannah 

Shaped my definition and assumptions concerning it. I remember being hosted in a new city by a family with teenage daughters about my age. I can still recall being struck by the beautiful tablescape branches from their yards decorated with fairy lights on a black table. 

00:01:59 Hannah 

And then after dinner, laughing our heads off as we followed along with old exercise videotapes. 

00:02:05 Hannah 

I remember more recently the joy of having friends and their kiddos over showing them the home projects we've been working on and then making some walls around the backyard fire. I can distinctly remember being in a class. 

00:02:19 Hannah 

The Creative Arts camp for young people and having conversations about the difference between entertaining and hospitality. 

00:02:27 Hannah 

That one is so often about impressing your guests while the other is about making them feel like family. The catalyst for all this wondering a book I devoured and won't stop talking about. Seriously, if you've seen me in real life in the past month or so, I've probably told you about. 

00:02:45 Hannah 

It unreasonable hospitality. 

00:02:47 Hannah 

By Will, Gadara has firmly wedged itself into my thinking and even my living. I'm inspired to be honest, to find both beautiful ordinary and crazy spectacular ways to extend hospitality to those I encounter. 

00:03:05 Hannah 

Now, this isn't a book review, and I'm not even going to be able to offer a very good. 

00:03:10 Hannah 

Summary of the. 

00:03:11 Hannah 

Book. There's just so much in there that I simply cannot cover it all. 

00:03:15 Hannah 

Instead I offer here the ideas and stories that stood out to me on my first reading. They are, as I remember them, so please forgive me if I don't represent them. 

00:03:25 Hannah 

With 100% accuracy, I'll tell you what I heard rather than what was said, OK. But also go. Dara grew up in and around the food and beverage industry. 

00:03:35 Hannah 

Leading to him also dedicating his working life to it. But his path took an unexpected turn when he ended up as general manager of a fine dining restaurant in New York. Badara writes about how his previous learning and experiences led him, and the head chef to aim to be the number one restaurant in the world. And they do it. 

00:03:55 Hannah 

By concentrating on the whole dining experience rather than predominantly focusing on the food, and it was a focus not just on hospitality, they were committed to extending hospitality quote so bespoke, so over the. 

00:04:11 Hannah 

Pop. It could only be described as unreasonable. So what did this look like? Well, there were some truly wacky and wonderful ways. What guidara calls improvisational hospitality. 

00:04:26 Hannah 

Well, I loved the story about a family visiting the. 

00:04:29 Hannah 

And as they ate next to a window in the restaurant, the children were transfixed by the falling snow, their first time seeing the stuff. 

00:04:37 Hannah 

Guidara's observation of this moment prompted him to immediately send a staff member to a nearby store to purchase 4 sleds and following the meal, the family were packed into a cab and taken to the perfect spot to finish their evening with sledding and fun in the snow, or when a table of diners spent the majority of the evening discussing a movie that loved and forgotten about. 


Thank you. 

00:04:58 Hannah 

The DVD of the movie arrived with the chick. How about a group of parents who were discussing the ethical ramifications of the tooth fairy and found a quarter under their folded napkins every time one of them came back from? 

00:05:10 Hannah 

The restroom. I loved that one. And then there was the family who felt like they'd packed in every New York City dining experience they could have dreamt of on their trip to the Big Apple. Except the classic New York hot dog. Unfortunately, after their meal, they were headed straight to the airport. In response, staff went outside, bought a hot dog from a street cart. 

00:05:30 Hannah 

Later that and served it to the family and according to the book, they freaked out. This all eventually led to the creation of a staff position titled Dreamweaver, whose entire job is to pay close attention to the guests and find creative, thoughtful ways to surprise. 

00:05:49 Hannah 

But it's not just those kinds of crazy examples. I can't stop thinking about. It's also the systems the team created to enhance their ability to extend hospitality at all times to all people. For instance, little imaginary roads and. 

00:06:08 Hannah 

That were mapped out in the restaurant. So wait, staff didn't need to use words to navigate around one another. Why? Because even those interactions could bump nearby diners out of an important conversation or a meaningful moment. Or how about this? It was their goal that every diner, even if it was their first time at the rest. 

00:06:29 Hannah 

Was greeted by name. That's right, Google and Facebook. Stalking of the reservation list meant that everyone felt no one and personally welcomed. Upon arrival the 11 medicine pipe team knew that when you design a system, you were designing an experience and every system was intended. 

00:06:49 Hannah 

To make the dining experience warm and customized to every single guest. Now I really do highly recommend that you read the book because the way that God I got there is truly fascinating. To get a glimpse into. But what I can tell you is that gardai. 

00:07:04 Hannah 

Knew that become a restaurant infamous for extending unreasonable hospitality, then that had to begin with his team. His commitment to caring for his staff while also setting a high standard of which they were then excited to live up to, meant that the hospitality they became infamous for came from an overflow. 

00:07:25 Hannah 

The staff cared for their guests and diners because they were cared for, and I think there's something important in there for us. 

00:07:34 Hannah 

Perhaps our little daily weekly and seasonal rhythms are systems that create an experience that delight. Perhaps our life rhythms are systems that enable us to extend hospitality to ourselves, like the difference between entertaining. 

00:07:54 Hannah 

The hospitality rhythms don't have to be rituals or special occasions. 

00:08:00 Hannah 

Ordinary, familiar, lovely routines are an act of hospitality to ourselves. Moments like taking time to smell the freshly ground coffee beans before making our morning coffee, or blocking out time in our calendar to take a 5 minute poem or short story break on some afternoons and creating systems. 

00:08:20 Hannah 

And rhythms that allow us to switch into autopilot, turning off the need for constant decision making and providing a sense of familiarity and security. Doesn't that too sound like a lovely gift to ourselves? What if all those little moments of familiar loveliness? 

00:08:37 Hannah 

I a hospitality to ourselves, added up and added up until it overflowed out of us. 

00:08:45 Hannah 

Until we couldn't wait, couldn't help extending some of that hospitality to others so they too could experience moments of delight, warmth and welcome. What if? 

00:09:03 Kris 

Hey, what do you reckon? If we are in New York sometime? 

00:09:07 Kris 

Sounds like fun. 

00:09:08 Hannah 

Sounds very good. Yes, let's go. 

00:09:11 Kris 

Did we go to new? 

00:09:12 Hannah 

York together. No. You went with my sister. 

00:09:15 Kris 

Oh, right, sorry. 

00:09:16 Hannah 

And your Airbnb I think like conked out the the. 

00:09:20 Kris 

Night before. 

00:09:21 Kris 

We were in Canada. That's right. We were in Toronto and. 

00:09:25 Kris 

And we cut out on the apple was like your sorry, your your combination has been cancelled or whatever they say. 

00:09:34 Hannah 

That's like my worst nightmare. You know, like everything, like all organized. And then I know what's going to happen, like, thank goodness. 

00:09:40 Hannah 

I wasn't on the. 

00:09:41 Kris 

Ohh man, it was a mad dash but we you know we we knuckled down, we got like you know we were inspired by. 

00:09:46 Kris 

The fear the. 

00:09:47 Kris 

Problem is, we had our flights booked. 

00:09:50 Kris 

Yeah. And obviously it's an international flight. So you on your customs form, you need like an address where you're staying. So that was what we were worried about because we couldn't land and then go, oh, we don't want to stay, but we'll we'll figure something out. It was like, yeah, but yeah. 

00:10:04 Hannah 

Yes, have, have you heard? 

00:10:07 Hannah 

That actually I think I've heard Manhattan have, like, changed their things now. So you can't have an Airbnb where someone stays less than like a month or something. 

00:10:14 Hannah 


00:10:15 Hannah 

Oh, really? Yeah, something like that. Someone I follow online is like, sort of half living there now. And I've heard about it. 

00:10:21 Kris 

Well, it's it's a tough it's a tough place to live in New York and it's nice that these restaurants are making an effort to humanize people and not just charging $20,000 per. I'm going to assume that I'm gonna assume as part of their unexpected or or what what do they call it? Hospital unreasonable. 

00:10:34 Hannah 

For the delay. 

00:10:41 Kris 

Hospitality that they would be charging. 

00:10:45 Kris 

Unreasonably or reasonably. 

00:10:47 Hannah 

Yeah, I think I assume for the experience that you have, I'm assuming that's sort of reasonable, but I think for those of us whose favorite food comes from McDonald's, it would probably be, if you're tears above voice, OK. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But no, I love that because, yeah, I have also visited New York. 

00:11:00 Kris 

It it would be high and it would be high end, yeah. 

00:11:09 Hannah 

And I think. 

00:11:11 Hannah 

I really enjoyed my time there, but there is a little bit of. 

00:11:14 Hannah 

Like a feeling like. 

00:11:15 Hannah 

There's areas where you don't quite feel like it's high end, so I loved reading about this place, which I think I if I visited this like fine dining establishment, there might still be a sense of like. 

00:11:31 Hannah 

Ohh I don't you know, feeling a bit fish out of water cause yeah, I'm not used to fine dining at all, but it sounds like you wouldn't stay feeling that way from everything I've described in this book. 

00:11:40 Kris 

Was it? That's what was interesting to me because. 

00:11:44 Kris 

The concept of fine dining has that almost a sense of like if you're not in that world and you, you like, dig out your best clothes. 

00:11:54 Kris 

And go into somewhere like that. It feels like high pressure. Like you don't know how to act or totally act the. 

00:12:01 Hannah 

Part yes. And actually I didn't get to touch on this. Ohh there's there's so so much in this book. I love it. Highly recommend but. 

00:12:09 Hannah 

The author talks about how hidden actually want to be in fine dining because it felt really stuffy and actually not very hospitable. You know, there's all this fine dining etiquette and so then what he wanted to do as well was make the fine dining experience something that people his age, like people in their 20s and 30s. 

00:12:30 Hannah 

Would want to. 

00:12:31 Hannah 

Experience because it was that, like quite stuffy formal thing. And he was like, can we not have fine dining that doesn't feel like that, but actually, it's like a wonderfully warm experience. And you feel knowing rather than you feeling like you have to fit within these, like confines and roles. And so again. 

00:12:51 Hannah 

Like sort. 

00:12:52 Hannah 

Talks about when he was brought on as the manager. There was some younger people new to the fine dining experience that he was hiring and who came in with him. But then there are also the staff who worked there for a long time, who were like, no, no, this is how we do things and this is how and they that was the world that they lived in. So trying to bring those two together, you just spent a long time at the start. 

00:13:15 Hannah 

Doing that and I talked a bit of my reflection about how he was just so committed him and the sheriff and some of the other leaders in the. 

00:13:23 Hannah 

To showing that he cared for the staff because then that would overflow into the dining experience and so being able to care for both of those groups of people and bring them together, that sounds like a huge accomplishment. And he did it and made fine dining really cool again. 

00:13:42 Kris 

Yeah. Well, that that's there's lots of layers today because it's not just about the food in this, a lot of, I think probably an older mindset would be that fine dining is equal to fine food like high quality ingredients, high quality preparation skill. 

00:13:59 Kris 

But this is more like. 

00:14:02 Kris 

It's like a holistic approach, you know, like and it sounds so pretentious, but it is it's it's considering not just the food, but the people consuming it and how they they react to it and thinking about him being presumably, you know, in his 30s and knowing that New York is probably one of the most. 

00:14:25 Kris 

It's it's quite a it's a grind, like it's a it's a concrete jungle. And so life goes 1000 miles an hour and you aren't really seen. You're you're in a massive city surrounded by people. You're just one of the crowd. And so to have a place where you are. 

00:14:44 Kris 

Saying I think it's that goes deeper than just a good experience. It's like a a firming experience. 

00:14:51 Hannah 

Totally. There's that quote from, like Maya Angelou, which maybe it's actually from her. Maybe not. But about how what you most remember is how people make you feel. And I think that that's what. 

00:15:04 Hannah 

They wanted to capture is like how people feel. And of course we will have like food experiences that we can recall and write about to sensory experience. But I think alongside that, the way that we've felt, the experience that we've had, that stays with us as well. And I think that that's what they tapped into. 

00:15:25 Hannah 

People have a really incredible experience and feel like and warm and well. 

00:15:32 Hannah 

That is a story that you'll keep talking about and telling, and you'll want to have it again. 

00:15:37 Kris 

As well, and it's great business because that's such a strong association with like your restaurant isn't just this place where you had this great meal, it was this whole whole thing I was telling you before we hit record about this hotel, Vanessa and I stayed at where? 

00:15:53 Kris 

It was very much. It was a it was. They leaned into being small, so it was. They only had six rooms. 

00:15:59 Kris 

But it was. 

00:16:00 Kris 

Highly curated, they had, like their own smell that they had, like gotten specifically made so that when you smell. 

00:16:08 Kris 

Hold it. I don't think you you could buy, you know, but you mentioned near other places that have done smells where you could buy the candle and take it home with you. 

00:16:16 Hannah 

Yes, I just watched a show with Chip and Joanna Gaines of fixed rubber fame and they have recently opened hotel and they did the same thing. They had their own scent crafted, which is like blasted through the hotel. But yeah, and there one you can buy. Of course you can. It's the USA. You can buy the candle and take it home. But like, I'm so do that because. 

00:16:35 Hannah 

I wouldn't take again. You wanna take the feeling with you, right? 

00:16:37 Kris 

When we try it. 

00:16:38 Kris 

We we tried to find it, we couldn't. We couldn't like that it was. It was only there because they they do a different. 

00:16:45 Kris 

One for each location. 

00:16:48 Kris 

Too. So it's not like they just do, you know, one for all of the locations. 

00:16:50 Hannah 

Sure. That's not the chain smell. It's like that, only that place. 

00:16:54 Kris 

It was, yeah, yeah. 

00:16:55 Kris 

They're really linked into it and they had, like, a concierge, but they really made an if they would use your name. 

00:17:02 Kris 

All the time. 

00:17:04 Kris 

Yeah, they would host you. There was like drinks in the library. So you could go up and that could be like cheese and. 

00:17:11 Kris 

Drinks and stuff and and they were just chat to you and get to know you and that was that was totally optional. 

00:17:18 Hannah 

But so do you think actually, do you think that there will be like a return to like actual B&B's and more like boutique hotels and stuff like that because obviously the world was like really gone. 

00:17:30 Hannah 

Airbnb, and probably most of us are like I don't want to meet anyone. I want that like chicken where I don't need to meet the person. Right? But do you think that there is going to be and we're starting to see like hotels do different things to kind of draw people? 

00:17:48 Hannah 

Back, but do you think that more people are gonna go? No, I I want to be hosted. There's something about being hosted and treated to that experience that you don't get when you just show up at the house. It's. 

00:17:59 Hannah 

Just an empty house. 

00:18:01 Kris 

I I think and this is probably more higher level than what you're asking, but we're societies. 

00:18:09 Kris 

Shifting back towards meaningful connection. 

00:18:14 Kris 

In sort of the wake of social media making everything so depersonalized and so quick that people are actually just starved for for real contact with people, which is another one of the layers I was thinking about when when I was reading about this restaurant, is that what could seem like a transactional thing? 

00:18:34 Kris 

You know, pay your money, eat the meal, go becomes an actual human point of connection and I think. 

00:18:41 Kris 

I think the. 

00:18:43 Kris 

And I'm not going to assume that this was part of Airbnb's business model, but this idea that you're going into someone's home is is a very like. 

00:18:53 Kris 

What's the word I'm looking for? It's a. 

00:18:55 Kris 

Very like. 

00:18:56 Kris 

It's it's almost sacred, you know. It's. Yeah, in a way. Like you're going into someone else's space and they're hosting you. And sure, there's a a business and financial aspect to it. 

00:19:05 Kris 

But there's that sense of connecting with someone else in a in a deeper and more meaningful way. And I think that is what is, I think, really interesting about this place is that it's not so much about the business outcome, although I'm sure it is. But there's a, there's this deeper sense of wanting to connect people to each other. And I think that's. 

00:19:23 Kris 

At the core of what? 

00:19:25 Kris 

Hospitality looks like and what it what it means for people? 

00:19:30 Hannah 

Yes. And I I kind of talked about very briefly and my reflection. 

00:19:35 Hannah 

That I have been involved in conversations about what hospitality is and when we're thinking about like hosting people in our own homes that sometimes people call that entertainment, you know, people talk about entertaining guests and the conversation that we had was, if you're entertaining, you're trying to. 

00:19:54 Hannah 

Impress your guests. A lot of the time. You know, it's like often entertaining is about you might have. 

00:20:00 Hannah 

Kind of flashy things because you can extend hospitality without being flashy and impressive, but it's more about. 

00:20:08 Hannah 

Maybe the couch that they sitting on has some crumbs from the kids and the mug that they get their tea served in has a little chip out of the handle. But the host remembered what sort of tea they like with that tea they liked without asking. That's a gesture of hospitality, but it's not entertaining. 

00:20:28 Hannah 

And I think I liked that distinction between that and there's nothing wrong with entertaining. I think there's a place for that. But I think hospitality is that meaningful connection that we're desiring more. 

00:20:42 Kris 

Yeah. And it's not just in your home. 

00:20:46 Kris 

As well, hospitality is in this like thing that just happens when someone comes over to visit or comes over for dinner. It's like a way of seeing the world where you want to make people feel welcome. 

00:21:00 Kris 

And same maybe maybe not welcome, but more, more acknowledged. 

00:21:05 Hannah 

Definitely. And I have you heard this quote before? I can. I've never been able to find that, but I used it in a presentation when we both worked together one time about how like the way. 

00:21:15 Hannah 

People feel after they've interacted with you as your trademark and I think yeah. And so if people walk away after interacting with you, feeling like warm and like they've experienced hospitality, like, don't we all want people to feel like they're around us? I do because I. 

00:21:19 Kris 

Oh, that's good. 

00:21:35 Hannah 

No value when I have experiences like like I can think of, I can think of a bunch of friends who I always feel like that after I've hung out with them or had a conversation with them. And those are people that you want to spend more time with and be like. 

00:21:50 Kris 

Truth and. 

00:21:52 Kris 

Not to make this do more good, but like. 

00:21:55 Kris 

You know, those are the stories that. 

00:21:56 Kris 

People tell that you're funeral. 

00:21:57 Hannah 

Yes, that's so true. And that's yeah. 

00:21:59 Kris 

You know that and that's that's what we've got in the end. We we can't really take anything with us. And for anyone out there who's wondered, you know, what's my legacy after I leave, you know, you might leave money somewhere or have done great things. But really it's how people remember you. And it's those moments. It's those moments of hospitality. 

00:22:20 Kris 

You've you've made, you know you've you've you've said inflicted your trademark. You've like stamped your trademark on them and they remembered that. 

00:22:31 Hannah 

Definitely. So I think that that's why I keep thinking about this book. When I read the book, I've been talking about the book. It's it's called unreasonable hospitality. There's also, like, a subtitled there, like I and unreasonable hospitality. And I think, yeah, that's what I want. 

00:22:39 Kris 

What's it called? 

00:22:52 Hannah 

My life to be one of the trademarks of my life to be, is that I'm someone who helped other people feel cared for and seen and welcomed and worn, and so. 

00:23:03 Hannah 

Of course, because it's me I'm thinking about. Like the rhythms of that. And I've described some of those crazy improvised, personalized, like bespoke ways that this team of restaurant tours and stuff. 

00:23:19 Kris 

You're telling me, telling me about? 

00:23:21 Kris 

Some of the really creative. 

00:23:23 Hannah 

Yes. And I've mentioned some of those in my reflection about how they created these amazing experiences. One off things and the dreamweavers were like solely responsible for that. 

00:23:36 Hannah 

Also, I loved probably what I tell people about more passionately is the systems that they put in place to help every person who visited the restaurant the. 

00:23:51 Hannah 

Hosted beautifully, right? So things that again I've described in my reflection, but like they never have to ask for their coat with a little coat check number or anything because there's someone who's like watching. And when they say, OK, that table is obviously about to get up and go like their coats are brought out. So they see them as they go to the door. 

00:24:12 Hannah 

That's beautiful. Or that a beverage is dropped off with the bill at the end. You can't feel rushed out if you're being offered this, like amazing beverage to enjoy, right? So. 

00:24:24 Hannah 

Every opportunity they have, they are going a little bit beyond, but they had these systems to help them do it on autopilot, so it wasn't all about, like, how do we personalize this amazing, crazy spectacular? Think there's just things that are just as natural to them as breathing that they do to host everyone. 

00:24:41 Kris 

Do you know what I wondered, though, when I read it? 

00:24:43 Kris 

Read about the the restaurants. How do they hire for this place? Because you have, you must have to have such a good EQ or a such a good system in place. 

00:24:52 Hannah 

Well, I think that's exactly as they look for people with AQ. They look people always. Yeah. For people, they do talk about that as well. Like if someone doesn't know how to do, you know, doesn't necessarily even have. 

00:24:55 Kris 

That must be a, say. 

00:25:04 Hannah 

Experience in that food and beverage industry, but they love to look after others and care for people that they. 

00:25:11 Hannah 

Preferred to hire them because that was the bit that was hard to give to someone. But you can train them with which side to serve. 

00:25:18 Hannah 

The meal on. 

00:25:19 Hannah 

Yeah, and how to Polish the silverware and those sorts of things? Yeah. Yeah. So. So I just think, how can I like, surely there's some systems that I can have in my life. 

00:25:33 Hannah 

And where I. 

00:25:34 Hannah 

Started my talk, went finish here, but where I started was the idea of the rhythms that are for us are really important because when we have rhythms that are showing hospitality to ourselves. 

00:25:49 Hannah 

Then I think we have enough to overflow and give to others, and I think that that's what a lot of our rhythms that we've talked about on this podcast are. Is that like taking time, slowing down, doing the familiar, lovely ordinary but lovely things like, I use. I love this example. I use it all the time. I'm so sorry I give myself the extra. 

00:26:09 Hannah 

10 or 15 seconds to smell my freshly ground coffee beans before I make my coffee every morning. 

00:26:16 Hannah 

That is showing hospitality to myself and when I have those things built in and I'm showing hospitality to myself, I think I'm in a better place to show hospitality to others. 

00:26:31 Kris 

Well, that's the thing. Hospitality doesn't. Yeah, that's right. It doesn't have to be an outward thing, only it can be an inward thing. It can be how you make yourself feel acknowledged and seen and important. And all of those. 

00:26:46 Hannah 

Totally. And again, you and I were talking about this just before we hit record. I don't want that like not mention it though, cause I thought it was such a good example is it doesn't have to be a special occasion to show hospitality to yourself. We were talking about the things that we save for one day. Like notebooks. Yeah, or candles. 

00:26:46 Kris 

Ways little ways. 

00:27:02 Kris 

Ohh yes, yeah. One day I'll use that. 

00:27:06 Hannah 

Like I have so many candles and I don't burn them because I want it to be special. 

00:27:13 Hannah 

But one day someone's going to have to clear out all my belongings and they're going to find like 300 blank notebooks and, like, 40 candles that I never got around to burning cause I wanted to say that like. 

00:27:25 Hannah 

The candles right in the notebooks, the special ones that you would save right on them and let it just be special. Because that's a way of showing hospitality to yourself. 

00:27:35 Kris 

Yeah, I've been saying lately. We can't let our one day be someday like it needs. It needs to be like we can't just constantly save. 

00:27:46 Kris 

The potential of a good experience or you know. 

00:27:50 Kris 

Going on a trip, whatever it is for someday because you know you never guaranteed something that guaranteed. One day you you're not even guaranteed today. So for sure. Why? Why not burn that candle? 

00:28:03 Hannah 

Exactly. And yeah, burn it every day, every morning during the autumn. And yes, it'll run out. But it's OK because. 

00:28:10 Hannah 

You can get a new candle or this. You can go for a walk or you know, there's other ways to show hospitality to yourself. But I think that those like we've talked about on this podcast so many times. We are the rhythm podcasts. Those things are important. They make a difference to us and. 

00:28:28 Hannah 

I think to be able to have them just on autopilot so we don't neglect them is so helpful. I think that's why I love a system I. 

00:28:36 Hannah 

Love a system? 

00:28:38 Hannah 

And therefore a rhythm, because maybe a rhythm is a type of system because it provides security, right? So like, I can anticipate what's going to happen, which helps me to feel more confident just today at work, like for very good reasons. The plan that I had for the day completely gone out the window. And then because of something else that's going to happen. When I go back to work in a few days. 

00:28:58 Hannah 

The plan for that day has also been tossed out the window, and it's OK because it doesn't happen all the time. But I do feel a little bit like the rugs been pulled out from. 

00:29:07 Hannah 

Under me. 

00:29:09 Hannah 

I like to know what's going to happen, because that helps me feel safe and secure. Also, like I said, I like to be able to go into autopilot. 

00:29:18 Hannah 

But the need to make decisions isn't fair so much. And because making decisions is really tiring and so to be able to go on autopilot sometimes and not have to constantly be making decisions, saves energy, creative energy. 

00:29:35 Hannah 

So yeah, so I think that's why I love a system in a rhythm. So of course, naturally, my mind's like. 

00:29:41 Hannah 


00:29:42 Hannah 

What are the rhythms for showing hospitality to myself, but also then beyond that, how can I show have rhythms and systems to help me show hospitality to other people? And I can put those in place like I can decide that. 

00:29:56 Hannah 

I'll be the one who offers to make hot drinks for everyone at our staff meeting, you know, and just make sure that when I'm, like, blocking out my time when I know there's a staff meeting, I can just block out an extra 10 minutes before that and go. OK, I'll. You know, that's one thing that I could. 

00:30:11 Hannah 

Or there will be some other good examples I could have like I loved this example is when guests leave this restaurant they receive like a jar of granola and it used to be like a different sweet gift or something. But you know people are leaving this restaurant having had multiple courses they probably aren't ready. 

00:30:32 Hannah 

To also have the sweet so often they imagined. 

00:30:36 Hannah 

These sweet treats were just sitting on counters at home overnight and then in the morning. It's like, oh, that's kind of like and tossing them away. So instead they started to give the guests jars of granola. So in the morning I wake up, I continue the dining experience from that restaurant. Cause now I'm having the my breakfast from that restaurant and remembering the wonderful time I had there. 

00:30:57 Hannah 

How I was treated like family and so special. So is this something that I can give to people who visit my home? That's kind of like pushing me a little bit more into the spectacular side. Maybe if I give them homemade granola or something, but it could just be like, hey, come walk with me through the fruit. 

00:31:13 Hannah 

Trees take a bag of lemons, take a bag of vegetables. That's something that doesn't cost me at all, but I can like just make that part of what I. 

00:31:22 Kris 

Always do. And you know what? Thank you. What's the restaurants name? 

00:31:27 Hannah 

It is a leave them. I have to. I wanna. 

00:31:30 Kris 

Believe in something. 

00:31:31 Hannah 

I wanna say 11:54, but that is a Wellington, don't you? Ohh. The bread rolls from there are my favorite. 

00:31:33 Kris 

That's it. I just had that for lunch. I. 

00:31:36 Kris 

Did it was great. 

00:31:39 Kris 

Yeah, they're delicious. We had we had. 

00:31:45 Kris 

Mr. Ron. 

00:31:46 Hannah 

It's called a liver medicine park. 

00:31:48 Kris 

Well, that's good. Good of 11 Madison Park, because they have also removed another decision that you have to make about what to have for. 

00:31:55 Kris 

Breakfast the next. 

00:31:56 Kris 

Day. But have you have? 

00:31:58 Kris 

You heard of decision fatigue. 

00:32:00 Hannah 

Yeah, I listen. Wait, wait. I listen to the next right thing and it's all about decision making. 

00:32:06 Kris 

Yeah, as tricky we we struggle with deciding what to eat. 

00:32:11 Kris 

All the time. What are we gonna have? 

00:32:11 Hannah 

I know I've been on holiday with you, Chris. I know. 

00:32:12 Kris 

For dinner, I don't know. 

00:32:14 Kris 

Ohh yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah, well, that hasn't stopped. We've still struggled to figure out what they think, what it is, is we both want to make each other happy. 

00:32:26 Kris 

And so we're like trying to figure out what the other person wants, but neither of us are like, ready to go. I actually, I feel like this or I feel like that. Well, Vanessa, does it more than me, but she'll be like, she'll list 12 things. And I'm like, can you just give me one that? 

00:32:41 Kris 

You just want to do. 

00:32:42 Hannah 

Yes, for sure. I I actually like same thing cause I'm trying. 

00:32:48 Hannah 

Serve meals for like 10 people right at my house four nights a week. And yeah, I've talked on this podcast for about how now I have every week the same time that I do my have my click and collect grocery order, so I know I have to be done by 12 hours before then, and then I've done my meal plan. Like the dinners for a whole month. 

00:33:08 Hannah 

And so yeah, like that, those decisions so easy now because I just on one day I sit down with two family members. We filmed the whole months of dinner the whole months worth of dinners, and then. 

00:33:20 Hannah 

And I don't have to think about it again. And yeah, you're right. Like it makes such a difference. 

00:33:23 Hannah 

When you have to make that decision every day. 

00:33:24 Kris 

And and it is. 

00:33:25 Kris 

Like what you're talking about is autopilot. You know, it's it's you do a little bit of work, but then you've got that system set out for the rest of the week. Whatever. What I what I like about the restaurant, though, is there's that sense of there's a little bit of a sense of chaos and the. 

00:33:44 Kris 

The way that they. 

00:33:45 Kris 

They don't always know what the right. 

00:33:48 Kris 

Peace of hospitality is for the guest, so the example you gave was like they talked about a movie. And so they they sent the DVD. 

00:33:57 Kris 

Yes, with them to the table obviously like someone had to be like picking up all of the cues and then someone probably had to dash out to like. 

00:34:07 Kris 

I shop and go and buy it like I actually love that crazy in the moment chaos as well. 


They sure. 

00:34:14 Hannah 

Yes, I know and like of course you want to be part of a team that does stuff like that, right, like I mean. 

00:34:20 Kris 

Well, yes and no. I think it says here with the right team. 

00:34:25 Kris 

Because then otherwise it's just destructive chaos where it's like you get sick of each other. But if you were having a if you had. 

00:34:31 Kris 

A great team. 

00:34:32 Kris 

Yeah. And you all got along and you were you. I think more than just got along. If you were all sold on the vision of what you were trying to do, that's probably a better way to put it is that we believe in what we're doing. And so we can live in. 

00:34:45 Kris 

That tension of a chaotic moment, knowing that the the outcome is what we will believe in. I've felt the same way when we've done events together, where the actual putting it together is chaotic and awful in lots of ways, but the the passion and the vision for it is what? 

00:35:06 Kris 

Gets us over the line. 

00:35:08 Hannah 

Yeah, yeah, for sure for sure. And I and I think like you have to have lots of trust and and relationship in there to probably get to that point where you can do. 

00:35:20 Hannah 

But I imagine yeah with this. With this team we are, like I said, in the reflection like they just had this commitment to caring really, really well for the staff and for the team knowing that that would make the difference and that people would come on board and trust them as well. 

00:35:39 Hannah 

There's so much on there cause also then they had. 

00:35:41 Hannah 

All these like. 

00:35:42 Hannah 

Areas where people who had like a little bit. 

00:35:45 Hannah 

Of like leaning into specializing in the area, they could be given an area of responsibility. So like often in a fine dining restaurant, you'd have someone who's like fully responsible for the wine, right? Will they decide? Oh, this, this guy who works for us and who's like, part of the wait staff who really likes beer. And so they made him the beer. 

00:36:05 Hannah 

Expert and he like brought in all these amazing specialty beers and they became really, really well known for that. They did it as well with someone who was into coffee and had like, a connection with someone in the city who was like running to. 

00:36:15 Hannah 

Coffee. They ended up having the best right? 

00:36:18 Hannah 

Because what they talked about is they had this amazing, you know, food experience and then they just get served, like, boring as coffee that you could get at the diner down the street. No. So they didn't do that anymore. They had this coffee guy who, like, fully changed, and it was just someone who'd come up through the ranks, right. They didn't out. They didn't hire from outside. A coffee expert was like, well. 

00:36:39 Hannah 

There's someone who has a knack in this area. Let's go and let them. 

00:36:44 Hannah 

All get all trained up and find the connections and then grower, coffee, special tea and house. 

00:36:49 Hannah 

They and the. 

00:36:50 Hannah 

One that I just loved again because I love a tidy house and I love the organised. 

00:36:54 Kris 

You're just. You're gesturing wildly, so I'm obviously, obviously you're really no one else can see this, but. 

00:36:59 Hannah 

As someone who was responsible for like like the glassware and crockery and stuff and they looked at like how the glasses were being stored and realized that. 

00:37:09 Hannah 

The amount of space was like half an inch too short, and so that's why a bunch of glasses keep getting broken and like chipped and so they just slightly changed how they stored the glasses and they this person also noticed when the dishwashing area they ordered, there's like rubber mats that could go on the benches next to the sinks. 

00:37:29 Hannah 

They ended up saving like an absurd amount of money by not breaking things because this person had gone. 

00:37:36 Hannah 

I can find slightly better ways for us to do this. 

00:37:38 Kris 

Yeah, I. 

00:37:39 Kris 

Love those little. 

00:37:40 Kris 

Operational efficiencies, right, and it's all in service of the goal, but that's it's so intensely practical too. That's yeah. 

00:37:47 Hannah 

Totally. And when you're saving money, then they've got more cause. Another thing he talks about. I haven't said in their affliction is like, be like very careful and like strict with how you spend 95% of your budget. 

00:38:00 Hannah 

So you can be foolish with the other 5% and when you're saving money, that really lets you do things like that, like one example before you was in this restaurant, he worked at like the Museum of Modern Art, not looking after kind of the fine dining establishment there, but all of the other dining experiences there. And he would look out on the sculptural garden and thought. 

00:38:21 Hannah 

There should be a Gelato cart in there, so we had a friend who had the best Gelato in the city, so he gets this Gelato cart going and he decides he wants these amazing, beautiful blue spoons. 

00:38:33 Hannah 

For the Gelato cart, you know, there's disposable, but beautiful blue spoons to for people to eat their Gelato with. They're expensive. They're from Europe or something that he's been so strict with how he's spent Nanny 5 spend the money so he can splurge. Use the 5% splurge on these. Beautiful. 

00:38:52 Hannah 

Cool. Amazing. Sculptural blue disposable spoons that people will use while they're in the sculptural garden at the Museum of Modern Art. And so eventually, you know, it gets all set up and they get kind of the top dogs in the in the museum to come and eat this Gelato at the Gelato car. Well, what are they all talking about? 

00:39:11 Hannah 

Afterwards, they're talking about the spoons. 

00:39:13 Hannah 

Because they're artists, right? And so they're, like, taken by these amazing spoons. 


Of course. 

00:39:19 Kris 

Would recognize that they would see past the the practicalities of it. 

00:39:27 Kris 

And see that someone had thought and and that's that's what a lot of art is. It's it's the meaning behind the piece so much more, more so than the piece itself. 

00:39:38 Hannah 

Yeah, so I loved. I loved that as well. 

00:39:40 Kris 

Ohh, police spoons. Alright, so we've talked a lot about hospitality and of course we're gonna ask the question, how is that gonna look like? What is that gonna look like going forward in this next week? While Hannah, you've got plenty of chances to be hospitable to the people around. 

00:39:57 Kris 

And you. 

00:39:58 Kris 

There's lots of people around. 

00:39:59 Kris 

You living there? 

00:40:00 Hannah 

OK, so first I I hope this doesn't sound selfish, but first of all I want to think about what's the different I can show hospitality to myself. And as you know I love like the seasons and we're coming into autumn now here in the Southern hemisphere. I've already sort of started bringing out some of those autumnal. 

00:40:18 Hannah 

Touches like. 

00:40:20 Hannah 

Foliage that looks more terminal. I've changed out the cushion covers and things, but I kind of still need that sensory water experience, so I'm like, you know what? I'm going to dig out the candles that I've been saving and burn them. It's getting darker in the mornings and the evenings. I can burn those and enjoy them. 

00:40:33 Kris 

Nice. Yep. 

00:40:37 Hannah 

So that's a way that I am going to show hospitality to myself and in terms of showing hospitality to others. Yeah, I think I'm going to challenge myself and try and be the person who makes hot drinks for others. I always feel like such a crazy person. I don't really know how to make cups of tea or cups of instant coffee. 

00:40:58 Hannah 

I don't know how to use the coffee machine at work because I just don't have hot drinks like that, but that doesn't mean I can't learn and do it for other people. And I work with like. 

00:41:08 Hannah 

Predominantly people who are older than me, so they all enjoy a cup of tea or coffee, so that's an easy way for me to care for others in a simple, ordinary way. 

00:41:17 Kris 

I was going to say the exact same thing. Actually I we we kind of take turns at work like if we're going out for a drink, we'll be like anyone want a drink? And then it's quite a nice little system we've got. So it's, you know my my my round you know but I I really want to learn how to like properly use an espresso machine. 

00:41:38 Kris 

Because the amount of times where I feel like that could be really a really nice way to. 

00:41:44 Kris 

Someone to to be able to make them that drink, cause and we we have great chats around a coffee machine when people are making the coffee at work my my colleague can operate it and so it feels would feel nice to be the one on the other side of that and and you know being the artisan rather than the person who just. 

00:42:04 Kris 

You know, cops it down. 

00:42:06 Kris 

So that that I think mines revolves around huge rings too. 

00:42:11 Hannah 

If there's nothing, if there's something we love on this podcast that is hot drinks, I think that's how we started this season, was talking about coffee. 

00:42:14 Kris 

It's a hops, right? Yeah.